Three shot groups. groups. CCI "APS" Large Rifle Primers Strip . 100%. . })(); To comment on a post, click Post Title or "Comment" Link. Match event calendar and rifle competition accuracy training tips. Check With Your Local Ammo. Small pistol primers - which are about the same size as small rifle primers but designed specifically for handguns. is a double base powder, same bullet and brass. One (minor) reason that small primer brass may be better than many standard LR types is that it usually noticeably easier to seat SR primers and to get good feel on their contacting the pocket floor. A homemade test of some primers that's interesting : Note the author says it's DMS (doesn't mean squat). Can you in. The Effects Of We used RWS match brass, 41.2 grains of VVN 140, and the Sierra 168 Closed the bolt and off she went. Copyright 2000-2023 24hourcampfire.com, Inc. All Rights Reserved. CCI No. The military imposes specific upper and lower sensitivity limits. This means a LRP will not seat flush or below the face of the case head in a pistol cartridge . Federal Champion Centerfire Small Rifle Primer - 100 Ct. No media assets available for preview. My .338 RUM likes 100 grains of H1000 behind a 225-grain Nosler Partition bullet. http://www.prfelr0.f2s.com/prfelr0/primers1.jpg, http://www.prfelr0.f2s.com/prfelr0/primers2.jpg. It is ever so slightly hotter than the small rifle magnum primer and it comes with a brass colored thick cup. http://www.serveroptions.com/ubb/Forum6/HTML/003275.html, [This message has been edited by Dutch (edited 02-08-2002).]. The following loads with 63 grains of H870, same bullet and AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own. Most basic there are large rifle primers. 0000002213 00000 n These include the 308, 25-06 Remington, 300 Weatherby magnum, and finally the 0000000016 00000 n 5180 meters per second for Azide, 5200 meters per second for Styphnate.3. in red which was frozen over night and then shot. - Cases that utilize small rifle primers and operate at higher pressures (55,000 psi) should use CCI 450, CCI BR4, Fed 205 and Rem 7 1/2. 0000054298 00000 n We had to stop our test at this stage, as our TRG-41 got 41 - Small Military Rifle Primers | 1,000 Count $ 119.99 $ 99.99. 0000153414 00000 n FWIW, Dutch. Note the spreads. I know everyone has a favorite, and although theyre really tough to get, I would really liked to see the Wolf LR-M in that mix. I think we have enough data above to get some sort of idea of how All 2:43 will have a large rifle . I thought this Reading primers tells you a lot about how hard the primer cups are, what your headspace is like, how big your firing pin hole is, and how sharp your firing pin is, but it doesn't tell much about peak pressure. Reloaders know that primers come in various designations: large pistol vs small pistol, large rifle vs small rifle, etc. 0000001728 00000 n mounts. Makes me think about some BR4 primers for my 6.5x47L over the #400. The LRP is at least .008 taller than the LPP and has a significantly thicker cup (not shown on chart). We are here to talk about primers. effects on this. 0 Buy in store-Limit 2. So what's the difference? All Primers have a different Brisance. 2854 0 obj <>stream My Components; My Loading Data; All User Loading Data; Components . These are the links to the two pages, directly. Out of stock. Seems they give me good results across the board. 0000028110 00000 n primers could be tested at different temperatures under the same conditions to see if temperatures made any difference. JavaScript is disabled. ALL Bulletin content is copyrighted, 2023 AccurateShooter.com. Hi Laurie, your comment re S&Bs slack fit raises my question. 0000054368 00000 n LPM = Large Pistol Mag . Take them with a grain of salt and as a guide only. $7.99. 0000077528 00000 n The Test. I cannot bullet, 55 grains of Reloader 19, in Winchester brass. 0000053144 00000 n were very even, but this was a limited lot and they are not widely available. Which is better for muzzleloading, large rifle primers or 209 primers?There are many different types of muzzleloader ignit. A write-up will be done soon. Heat of explosion per gram is similar as well. When I use the press the primers are seated harder.In your opinion would there be a difference in ES because of the seating mechanism? In the recent past I had been using BR-4's but have found the extra flash from #41's to give me slightly better groups at 1k. Primer sizes can be broken down as follows: Small rifle primers - which are about .175 inches in diameter and .120 inches tall. brass. The only thing they changed was the primer. 0000015415 00000 n www.6mmbr.com. Non-corrosive, all weather primers deliver fast, dependable ignition under any shooting condition. I guess what my question boils down to is whether you think the range of primer performance you observed in your test here would carry over to other cartridges and powder selections. The pressure changed dramatically sometimes (8k-13k PSI). Also, though I did not retain the article, some years ago I recall an article in Shooting Times that addressed the hotness of primers. LP = Large Pistol . In other words, the steps were small indeed. following primers in our possession. Here are the primer types tested: Test Rig: Osprey Rifles-built F-TR rifle with Savage PTA action, 32 Bartlein 1:12-twist Heavy Palma barrel, and Dolphin Gun Company modular stock with an F-Open/Benchrest fore-end. Primer Testing Reference. I have to wonder if the lack of hard data comes from the manufacturers not wanting to be held to some yahoo's feeble attempts to "prove they cheated me" with craptasticly bad "testing." Three shot groups. The rationale for doing side-by-side tests is to see what effect primer choice has on ballistics, i.e. Ive since rerun the series with .308 Win Palma brass and small primers. Sep 9, 2009. 2 Winchester WAALite 37 VihtaVuori N340. 1.09K Views. 0000027119 00000 n However, if the trends among the primers you tested hold true across a wide variety of different powders and cartridges, it would greatly facilitate selecting a small number of different primers to keep on hand to test in the event that the first choice was unsatisfactory. 6,5 to 9,3 mm. SPM = Small Pistol Mag . CCI 300 STD Large Rifle Primers - 100 Ct. No media assets available for preview. Remington HTP .38 SPC 110-Grain Ammunition - 50 Rounds . 0000076375 00000 n Buy in store-Limit 2. Primer with Biggest Group Size: CBC Magtech 9 (0.7 average, three 5-shot groups). All Rights Reserved. were of 50 when limited amounts were available. I finally had a primer fail, just last week. CCI 350 Magnum Large Pistol Primers 100-Pack $ 6 99 6 dollars 99 cents. Therefore choose based on other factors, such as accuracy, low ES/SD, cost, cup hardness . Editors Comment: Laurie shot three, 5-shot groups at 100 yards with each primer type. Does this indicate that one primer creates more pressure for about the same velocity or does this mean that some primers will withstand more pressure before showing signs of failure? For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Total group size variance (from best to worst) was 0.27. _gaq.push(['_setDomainName', '.accurateshooter.com']); (function() { .2232, 16 CCI 300 LP 3.18 What I wonder is how they differ in their caloric content (energy content). way up the neck. $47.99: NA: Notify: Midway: Winchester Large Rifle Magnum Primers 8-1/2M. 506 0 obj <> endobj Thank you very much for your efforts in providing this excellent article. And small you have Magnum. endstream endobj startxref All powder charges LP = Large Pistol LPM = Large Pistol Mag SR = Small Rifle LR = Large Rifle LRM = Large Rifle Mag BLR/BSR = Berdan (not available) Primer Size and Bullet Diameter Chart - 2 4050 S. Clark, Mexico, MO 65265 www.grafs.com 800-531-2666 32 Short Colt .313 SP 32 Winchester Special .321 LR 32-20 WCF .312 SR 32-40 WCF .320 LR 325 Winchester Short . It confirms what many of us have known for a long time. Remington says the compound is the same as the 6, but with a thicker cup. It is obvious that the thicker cups will withstand more pressure. Large Rifle = LR, Large Rifle Magnum = LRM, Large pistol =LP, Brand/type Power Average Range Std. Quest for Less Vertical Six Primer Types Tested at 500 Yards, Vertical Dispersion Test Six Primer Types Tested at 500 Yards, Primer Availability Report Wolf Primers Have Arrived, Primer Comparison Testing with 6 BRA at 500 Yards. 1 Fed Match GM215M 6.12 5.23-6.8 .351. Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more. 0000053767 00000 n Your first post mentioned measuring the depth of the primers, and to my way of looking at the world, that . Holland, a talented shooter from the UK, tested no less than sixteen (16) different large primer types using a custom F-TR target rifle shot from the bench. Remington 9-1/2 Large Rifle Centerfire Primers - 100 Ct. No media assets available for preview. It has no pistol primers, but if you look at the difference between the Remington 6 1/2 and 7 1/2, that's pretty typical of the difference between a standard rifle and a magnum rifle primer, though the material the 6 1/2 is stamped from is softer than the CCI of the same thickness and is known to leak gas if it is used in the .223. Primer Size Chart . I can tell you CCI BR2's give a little less velocity and better SD numbers than Federal 210M which gave a little less velocity and better SD numbers than Remington 9 1/2 with the same powder and cartridge. 4 Comments. This has been noted by some sharps shooters when they break a firing pin. we will try it to see how it performs. Great article/op. Add to cart. 6 rounds with the RWS primers hang fired, including 2 of Do not use these charts for load development. Three shot groups. well in this rifle before, and we did the same with VVN 540, as it is supposed Not that I have found, and why I said "nothing". And standard both Magnum. It seems to even out the ignition by eliminating a variable (sometimes with grains in and sometimes without Dont know why they tested 210M primers as they seem to have gone the way of the passenger pigeon. You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers. This primer can be used in place of the SRM primer or used when a different powder is used that is hard to ignite." Large Rifle Standard Of the others, there WAS a relation between weight and power. were selected and match prepped, all have the same weight. $ 249.99. Let us start with Large Rifle Primers (LRP) vs Large Pistol Primers (LPP). And, NO! Cameron. This is a great post and definitely deserves a sticky in the reloading section, Thanks for posting. The following loads were shot in a Remington 700 chambered The following are the results of a 308 Winchester, shot in We were using standard large rifle primers for all cases up The following are with 75 grains of Reloader 19. RWS, CCI BR2, Federal 210M, Federal 210, Federal 215 and Winchester standard and magnum LR primers. In fact, from testing I and others have done, it almost seems to be capricious in nature, and therefore unpredictable as to which primer(s) might be the best alternatives to test when one is not giving satisfactory results. The standard primer sizes for metallic centerfire (rifle and pistol) cartridges are small (.175" diameter) and large (.210" diameter). $12.99. _gaq.push(['_trackPageview']); 3.7-5.5 .3997, 10 CCI BR2 4.37 A few were of 50 when limited amounts were available. The new Russian borrowed. 0000077042 00000 n June 3rd, 2015 LR Primer Types Tested for Velocity, ES/SD, Group Size and More! When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. Large Rifle Primers Fed 215 WLRM CCI 250 Rem 9 M WLR F210 CCI BR2 CCI 200 Rem 9 Small Rifle Primers Fed 205 Rem 7 WSRM Fed 200 WSR CCI BR4 CCI 400 Rem 6 1/2 July 9, 2018. Most of the tests were of 100 or more primers. trailer For this we would leave some loaded rounds in the freezer, and Originally designed for the bolt-action Mosin-Nagant rifle, it was used during the late tsarist era and throughout the Soviet period to the present day. Out of stock. I usually buy several sizes and types of primers in lots of 5000, or 10,000 about once every year or so, as I do most of the reloading for out hunt group,Its not unusually to knock out a couple hundred cartridges in an evening with my dillion reloaders). of those horrible looking plastic stocks. This extensive test is an important contribution to the knowledge base of precision shooting. http://www.sksboards.com/smf/index.php?topic=56422.0, http://www.mpzflame.ru/production/primers/, www.sinclairintl.com/product/11248/Primer-Pocket-Tools, https://www.rcbs.com/priming/bench-mounted/automatic-priming-tool/16-9460.html, The Snobbiest Town in The Snobbiest State in the N, Fiocchi, Ginex, Murow Small Rifle Primers, Experience 223 Remington. 2.7-3.5 .2406, 17 Federal 150 LP 3.11 I think it is fair to say that even the cooler primers work, providing the reloader has been careful to work up the loads and allows for volume, powder coatings and temperature at which the loads will be used. PSA 300blk with some off brand remanufactered ammo. Second Media Corp., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada. Ive had a slam fire. CCI BR2 and the Fed 's were the most even of the common ones. It stands to reason that such cusp cartridges, as I like to call them, would have . %%EOF The main question that remains for me is how the primers results might vary between different cartridges, bullet weights, and powder loads. Keep them all the same. I load those in hornet 222 220 swift and other varmint calibers. I also had no problem finding the thread in the archives. I thought wolf and tula were unobtanium via Russia? Winchester Large Rifle primers produced a standard deviation of velocity of 13 f.p.s. rintable Burn Rate Chart. As Slamfire said, the #34 and #41 military hard primers likely will be more constant. For this test, I used previously necked up and fireformed Norma 22-250 brass, body sized with a custom Redding . average velocities and MV consistency. 0000076644 00000 n 3.2-5.6 .5171, 15 KVB 45 LP Russian 3.89 3.3-4.2 According to the same Internet sources, the Federal Gold Match Large Rifle Magnum primers (215M) are at the top of the list in terms of heat. CCI BR2 Large Rifle Primer 100-Pack $ 13 99 13 dollars 99 cents. Many handloaders think the 215 is still the hottest commercial rifle primer, but the CCI and Winchester magnum rifle primers are just as hot, if not a little hotter. $5.19. I am using RCBS bench priming tool model 9460 link here: Strange that Lyman is a #2 and RCBS is #3 shell holder. the results of each group so you can compare that with others, as well as the group 18,4. mounts. These primers use a heavier, thicker cup to withstand the more intense small-cased rifle cartridges such as the .222 and .223 Remingtons. 0000005537 00000 n Doesn't appear to work. #34 and #41 are military primer designations for large and small rifle primers, respectively. Laurie Simply outstanding work and write-up as I always expect when you are involved! Reply. The redesigned metal parts improve sensitivity and reduce seating force. I only remember that there wasn't a heckuva lot of difference in any of them, until you start comparing one end of the list against the opposite. This testing was done to try and rank primers by power (brisance). Most of the tests were of 100 or more primers. things might turn out. did the bedding, and installed a Leupold 4-12 X scope in Leupold mounts. Compare Compare Now. Gold Medal Centerfire Primer .205. Are Wolf Primers still consistent? Thanks OP for posting. var ga = document.createElement('script'); ga.type = 'text/javascript'; ga.async = true; But rules of thumb aren't perfect, and plenty of cartridges use charges from 55 grains to 65 grains .30-06, .270 Win. Out of stock. 4.1-6.0 .4300, 7 Remington 9 1/2 LR 4.75 3.7-6.25 .5679, 8 Fed Match GM210M 4.64 4.0-5.6 .3296, 9 Federal 210 LR 4.62 For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. The following loads were with 48 grains of VVN 550 powder, That article featured actual pressures changes in identical charge weights using Lake City Match brass, Sierra 168 grain Match Kings and 40.5 grains of IMR-4895. I took four large pistol primers (CCI 300's), four large rifle primers (CCI 200's) and four large rifle bench rest primers (CCI BR-2's) and measured the width and depth of all three primer types. . Lyman & Nosler classify this as a standard primer, but Hornady, Handloads.com, and Chuck Hawks classify it as a small rifle magnum primer. Read more; CCI #34 7.62mm Military Primers. For starters, based on the loads tested, which duplicate maximum published 6.5 Creedmoor loads with the bullets used, large-rifle primers are on average 19.66 percent better than small-rifle . His subsequent usage of Winchester Large Rifle standard lit all his powder. The standard pocket for a Large Pistol primer is somewhat shallower than its Large Rifle counterpart, specifically, 0.008 to 0.009 inch less. test, using all the different primers that we have here. The average group size for the top six primers varied by only 0.10 (0.43 to 0.53), so one cant conclude that one type is much better than another. One of the frozen rounds with the CCI BR 2 hang fired. It's higher than 30-30, and not much less than the 30-06. 50 BMG (BMG) CCI - No.35. As an aside, a couple of years ago, shortmags.org published a list of primers from hottest to coolest. Very good read. It is relative to this set of tests and this tester. If you shoot a .308 Win, or any cartridge that uses a Large Rifle (LR) primer, you should read an important new article by Laurie Holland in Target Shooter Magazine.Holland, a talented shooter from the UK, tested no less than sixteen (16) different . I like the Wolf/Tula also because there a couple .0001s larger diam. Ranked in order of power. I think I am going to try out some 450's now because I don't need to worry about slam fires in my 6.5x47L and they tend to be cheaper. Another unexpected finding was that with all of the 17-round strings halted for 15 or more minutes for barrel cooling between shots 10 and 11, in over half of the strings shot 11 produced a (low) MV that was out of the range of the others and had to be discounted. CCI Bench Rest Large Rifle Primers 1000/Box $199.99; Notify Me When Available; Brand: CCI; Item Number: 10 BK; CCI Large Rifle Primers 1000/Box $149.99; Notify Me When Available; . This is where the similarity ends. I found this a while back but it seems it goes against the Win primers being hotter than the CCI. Three shot groups. Mother of All LR Primer Tests 10.3x60mm Rimmed LR Swiss 10mm Auto LP 11x59mm Rimmed LR French Gras 43 Mauser 17 Hornet SR Check With Your Local Ammo. JavaScript is disabled. Interesting read, thanks! Virtually all primers today are made using either Lead Azide or Lead Styphnate as the priming compound. I learned Cci 400 and cci 550 are the same! But if you cant spare the time right now, here are some highlights below: Primer with Lowest Velocity: Remington 9 M Magnum (2780 fps) Shotgun (209) CCI - 209. 100. AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types. PRODUCT No: TYPE OF PRIMER USED FOR PCS PER BOX 6mmBR.com is the best guide for 6mm BR Benchrest precision shooting, complete with 6BR FAQ, Reloading Data, Shooter Message Boards, Reader Polls, and Photo Gallery. 5 Alliant e3 40 Ramshot True Blue. Handloader Magazine does it every once in a while. Add to Wishlist. The effects of different primers, normal and magnums, on a Interesting and informative article but it raises a couple questions in regards to Rem 6 1/2 that I've been unable to answer this far. What changed about the 6 1/2 to suddenly make it suitable only for low pressure cartridges? It takes a Large Rifle Magnum primer to reliably light this much powder. It is beyond question that switching primers can often improve (lower) ES/SD with a given load. brass. I know this powder is far too slow for this application, but we thought They can cause primer piercing within stout loads in .223 Remington applications. Trying to decide which primers to buy next. Remington AmmunitionRemington Large Rifle Magnum Primers #9-1/2M Box of 1000. to be similar in burning rate. The Wolf Small rifle with the copper cup I've had failure to fire with my light striking bolt guns, but they go bang every time in my ar15. Dev, 1 Fed Match GM215M 6.12 5.23-6.8 .351, 2 Federal 215 LRM 5.69 Both are roughly the same diameter. We re The following are with 80 grains of VVN 165, same bullet If you shoot a .308 Win, or any cartridge that uses a Large Rifle (LR) primer, you should read an important article by Laurie Holland in Target Shooter Magazine. Buy Reloading > Components > Primers - Gun City are the leading firearms experts in New Zealand. We have found the following primers in our possession. Between these two extremes are Large Rifle primers of almost any brisance level. Well done gentlemen, Share the post "Ultimate Large Rifle Primer Shoot-Out 16 Types Tested". If you are to use the taller Large Rifle primer, we recommend reaming the primer pocket deeper (.125"-.132"). 41 Rifle Primers - 100 Count. Fiocchi Large Rifle Primers. 0000012690 00000 n I found this a while back but it seems it goes against the Win primers being hotter than the CCI. Great OP. grains in, or a variety of combinations). Many handloaders think the 215 is still the hottest commercial rifle primer, but the CCI and Winchester magnum rifle primers are just as hot, if not a little hotter. It is a standard factory issue; we bedded the 2847 0 obj <>/Filter/FlateDecode/ID[<17398BDBD67F214CBB3755FAA4BE7340><20967B39C4AB1349BB25AF309099C3A9>]/Index[2829 26]/Info 2828 0 R/Length 94/Prev 197341/Root 2830 0 R/Size 2855/Type/XRef/W[1 3 1]>>stream var _gaq = _gaq || []; All cases for each group Firing pin strength also seems to be a definite factor. Between these two extremes are Large Rifle primers of almost any brisance level. I have never looked at primers apart from reliability. Keep to the lower end of reloading recommendations. CCI "APS" Large Pistol Primers Strip No. This is on a DMS (don't mean squat) scale. . CCI 250 MAG Large Rifle Primers - 100 Ct. $9.49. Copyright 1996-2023 AR15.COM LLC. Fishing Bait Chart; Hunting Camo Patterns; Guns. 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